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What Happened to this Sarouk???
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#1 Posted : Wednesday, January 07, 2009 12:33:41 AM(UTC)
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Hi for a change....this place is a haven I was so lucky to come upon in my state of obession trujping the need for sleep.

I just came upon this on ebay:

http://rover.ebay.com/ro...&mtid=824&kw=lg

This vendor is hardly meticulous: lots of graphics do not make up for an absence of accurate data. On the other hand some apparently high end dealers fail to offer necessary data on their sites I recently learned, not just KPSI: any repairs, is foundation brittle??.... the stuff U need to know. It is counter to the natural world to even think about buying a decent rug without seeing it, touching it, rolling around on it; you would think deales would get that, right?

This rug is little too florid for me, I think, tho I do not wanna be stuck in a narrow, unactualized vision, but it misses that feel/look: the vivid but not garish of semi-antique "American" Sarouks like the one I loved.

But it is also clearly compromised... by WHAT? WHAT HAPPENED to this (not as old as he says, bettcha) rug?? PMS?

Did someone bleach it? That's not sun damage I don't think. Is it? Is it that abrash thingy? Color bleed? Did they paint Sarouks after the 40s?

The field at its darkest is not dark enough to have been painted, right?

Thanks for puttning up with all my confusion. Also my relentlessness in anything I become emersed in and determined to own fully over time.

Jill
Jilly attached the following image(s):
Sad Sarouk.jpg
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KrowGyrl Offline
#2 Posted : Wednesday, January 07, 2009 5:33:25 AM(UTC)
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He states the rug is in excellent condition. What I am going to say should not be used by you in determining if you are going to buy this rug. However ----- I have bought over 300 rugs and kilims on eBay and what I have found many times is that the color rariation you are seeing is nothing more than light bouncing off the weave and reflecting lighter spots than are actually there. A lot of these people over blast the flash to show detail but they create this inaccurate color fluctuation. I'd want to see that in person. But looking at it on my screen, it looks like that phenomena I have seen before. But you can't tell and the rug is too expensive to take a chance sight unseen. The fact that he is advertising excellent condition makes me think the rug is no where near as bad as it looks in the picture, in which you can't really see closeup detail of what look like bad spots. I found that some of my cheaper buys were great ways to learn about what things look like on eBay and in photographs like they use there as opposed to what the real rug looks like.
RugPro Offline
#3 Posted : Wednesday, January 07, 2009 11:15:25 AM(UTC)
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Light variation is definitely a factor. My first inclination was to think this was a stripped painted american sarouk. For this type of sarouk, it's not uncommon for the ground to be painted and now to meet todays standards be stripped of this paint, revealing the lighter tone, but also sometimes taking away some of the red leaving a rose.

Again, I thought this could be a stripped rug, think it's just lighter toned dyes. I don't know why but the weave almost looks indian to me, but the design I think would have been way too good for the majority of weavers around this time in india. I still think it's a nice looking rug
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#4 Posted : Wednesday, January 07, 2009 12:51:03 PM(UTC)
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Wow.....a brace of brilliant guys here!!!!!!!!

Just came hme and found the below following from this Joseph person....I am sending both of you Ferraris. U can sell them and buy at least one historically significant, rich with mythology silk prayer rug at Sothebys. (It's the thought that counts, not only the kpsi, OK?)

I will now paste......and truth be told, I like it too. I am so paranoid I am afraid to get attached. I will include the mail with my response.

But this is is very new carpet with poverty of provenance. No doomed lovers wept on it, OK? lol

1)
Right, the rug is not very old and in fact has no damage and no problems with the color. The “splotching” effect is from the sun hitting the wool and reflecting. There would be no splotching effect indoors. You might understand this better if you were to imagine yourself vacuuming a rug or carpet. When you vacuum, you create lines because you brush the nap of the rug in opposite directions. This is the same with this rug. If the nap was all perfectly flat, there would be no splotching. It is not perfectly flat in the pictures because the rug was stored rolled and was not vacuumed before the picture. Let me assure you: There is no color problem with the rug.



I appreciate your questions. I know it is hard to buy rugs just from pictures. Do you have any other questions?



-- Joe Nevo --

Over 20 Years in the Antique and Rug Business!!



From: Jillmorrisone@
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 4:45 PM
To:
Subject: Re: You've received an answer to your question about item NICE Semi Antique P...


Hi, Joe,

OK thanks, but what is the color loss in the filed....the splotching due to if I may ask?

I doubt the rug is old enough to have been painted.....tho naturally, I am not sure.

I appreciate yr help on this.

Jill
_______________________________________________________
(I removed some email parts.....feeble attempt at trying to be less impulsively open)

2) Wow.....excellent dense with data response. So whole appearance issue was photographic distortion & nothing inherent in the carpet.
In fact, given what you share, the photographic distortion may reflect a nice sheen.
I was originally searching for the right semi-Antique "American" Sarouk from the halcyon days of those....20s & 30s, but the ones I like, in the condition I want go for a small fortune. And I do not mean Ferahans.

I appreciate these data, Joe. How new is this rug ya think?

Jill


________________________________________________________________________
To the two geniuses again:
God I am so thrilled and nourished by keen and savvy, forget augmented by generous1... and people wo live their passions including profesisonally.

Bless you guys!
**********************************************

Edit-Addendum-update:

Thanks again, Joseph.....the level of old I like is probably beyond me.
I think I am liking this rug......it's a JOURNEY into clarity....at last, for me.

Jilly

In a message dated 07-Jan-2009 6:17:02 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, joenevo@joenevo.net writes:
Jill,

It is not real old rug (30 yrs or so).

joe

RugPro Offline
#5 Posted : Wednesday, January 07, 2009 2:00:38 PM(UTC)
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Personally, I think it's an awesome rug.

Here are the only quick questions that I would ask prior to purchase.

Not really all that integral, but very worthwhile just for information purposes and negotiating leverage if it comes up. You want to know everything about the rug before purchasing.

1. What is the country of origin. This very much looks like a 12/60 quality Indian weave. Please provide knot density for relative purposes.
2. Are BOTH ends fastened and secured: for example, one photo we can see the overcasted end, is the other side overcast and properly finished as well?
3. Has the rug been luster washed
4. What is the return policy
5. Is the pile still sharp and clearly defined, or does it show blooming.

If the return policy is not acceptable and if the rug is Indian, I would negotiate based on these two factors. I would take it down to $1350 including shipping and insurance. Ask for an option of return within 7 days, return shipping at cost, no restocking fee. Insurance is important. A friend of mine purchased from this seller Joe nevo. They got an outstanding deal, but the rug was horrendously packed with one sheet of plastic and had a slight moth flake odor. It arrived okay and quickly. The moth flake odor usually goes away pretty quick, and is not the case with all rugs. Just know this is the common product of some washing techniques and it will go away.

Keep us updated,
Guest
#6 Posted : Wednesday, January 07, 2009 2:02:24 PM(UTC)
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Gentlemen, if I may some follow up questions:

RugPro, are you saying 30 years ago---as per above, Joe says he thinks it is around 30 years old--- rug artisans in India were not sophisticated enough to gestate or render this design? Meaning it was probably made in Iran?

KrowGyrl: When you say "expensive" do U mean the capital outlay level per se or that the rug is not worth his asking price given the specifics? Hope I am not violating some protocol by asking this, if I am it is inadvertent.

Thanks again......had I not found this little haven, I might have remained stuck with my current ugly from the garbage (I am still staggered it is worth something) and far too ignorant and so afraid.... to get something I love.

Jill
RugPro Offline
#7 Posted : Wednesday, January 07, 2009 2:17:27 PM(UTC)
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Jilly wrote:
Gentlemen, if I may some follow up questions:

RugPro, are you saying 30 years ago---as per above, Joe says he thinks it is around 30 years old--- rug artisans in India were not sophisticated enough to gestate or render this design? Meaning it was probably made in Iran?


Assessing a rug from photographs is tough. Especially when they're not really the pictures which would help to determine such info. The seller has not provided a close up of the selvages, knot density or fringe going into the pile. Evaluating what a rug may be can often take many careful reviews of images. Several peeks, additional consideration, and mulling over what it may be....

I think this could be newer than 30 years old, and I think India is a very possible origin. You've brought a lot of really awesome examples to the forum. Angel For the rugs you feel need more more inclined toward than others, just give it a star and these we can really evaluate with more thorough consideration. Judging by pics is hard and can take some time
KrowGyrl Offline
#8 Posted : Wednesday, January 07, 2009 2:58:54 PM(UTC)
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KrowGyrl: When you say "expensive" do U mean the capital outlay level per se or that the rug is not worth his asking price given the specifics? Hope I am not violating some protocol by asking this, if I am it is inadvertent.>>>

I suppose it's relative. $1000+ price for a rug I have not seen and I don't know personally is "too much" to pay for a hunch. If it's a rug whose provenance I know, which is impossible on eBay, then sure, and if there is a complete return guarantee. But I would not lay out that much money on a sign unseen rug. If it's a dealer you have a realtionship with and you can return, then perhaps. The quality of the picture is not clear enough to really see the rug. Many dealers on ebay have much better pictures than that and you can really see what's going on with the rug.
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#9 Posted : Wednesday, January 07, 2009 5:49:39 PM(UTC)
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Again, I am so grateful to both of you. I am not used to even asking for help. A kind of self-protective defense, actually......but with many upsides. Also downsides.

I will factor in & follow up on all of the above from both of you; I am grateful for all of it. Whole new animal now, 'LUSTER WASHED"....sounds like something offered at some faux cache ridden hair salon for high maintenance females, right? lol

I do not get why anyone thinks I know anything about rugs......but I do thank you for the compliments, however unearned.

I too really like the rug. Unfortunately.

I may just put a toe in the eBay water, inspired by KrowGyrl.....I have my eye on something a ilttle pathetic...not time to share but I iwll.....probably a mess, little garish but also has some charm....too small, not at all like the one I luv which may be Indian & not at all from Iran......I will find out, trust me. If I can get this new kinda Sarouk I never heard of....but now read all about, for little money, it will be an investment in getting momentum and learning about rugs on eBay......I mean it. It will embolden and inform me. that's woth money, that.

I have gotten around 140 things on ebay, everything form motherboards, one of my Optiplexes, to silk duvets to babyphat jeans....and I have been thrilled 99% of the time. Big education in the real value of everything.

But I need a tiny bridge transaction before I go for the gold......after I determine if it, the rug i like too much is, in fact gold or plated pot metal. Hah hah.

More later.....bless you Two!!!!!!
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#10 Posted : Wednesday, January 07, 2009 7:44:33 PM(UTC)
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Ok that was harrowing. I am terrible multitasker and ought not be doing any of this whiile working,. But I did.
Other day, I came upon the only cheap rug I have seen on ebay I was drawn to. Different from any other rug I have been drawn to. It is probably garbage, in bad shape, but it had whimsy and personality......a kinda pre-adolsecent, I am not formed yet, coltishness. OK that was a bit much.

Not much before the end of the auction, it was at like $119. So I bid. Then, between clients, other bidders upped the action, one, tapdancing nimbly.....people who were NOT WORKING......I raised my max bid a couple of times, but at the end, I was on wiht a client, and in the last seconds, the nimble snipper snipped.

I am little relieved......cause maybe this toe in he water phenomenon inspired by KrowGyrl.....isn't for me. But when he shared it, I felt it and I liked it and felt I would learn from it.

Bary O'Connell.....I Googled upon a delineation of his of this on this genre of Sarouk I never heard of, SABZEVAR.....very interesting stuff:
http://www.persiancarpet...an/Khorasan/khor996.htm

These puppies with their center medallions--- I used to hate all center medallions cause most are so cliche-- the center medallion on this rug had adolescent kinda ungainly JOY and was not cliche. For a not serious or major purchase, it drew me, for all the reasons herein....go figure....I even liked its atypically NOT BLUE RED, ground color despite it is in yr face....I felt it worked and was nicely balanced by both the medallion and the borders and the colors in both. All I can say is.....the little rug was WAGGING ITS TAIL. Most of the low money garbage I've been obsessively moved to look at on ebay DON EVEN HAVE A tail.

Joe's rug don have a tail and does not need a tail.....it is luminous and transporting & conveys it's essence and emotion a different way. Not adolescent. ADULT .Not canine, feline. Cats do not do tail wagging; they are ABOVE IT.

But I was talking with a client and not on this desktop.....and the sniper snipped in the last seconds. I think I upped my bid to $253 & change... sniper got it for a couple of dollars more. When I first saw this rug and responded to it, I was even embarrassed.....it is not AT ALL what I thought I would be drawn to. But again, a modest, BRIDGE PURCHASE-learning experience; I have never bought a rug in my life....It felt right and a low risk part of this journey which commenced only around 10 days ago ......and I am sorry I missed it. I was dying to see the reality of it, feel it's "music" cause it had rhythm and melody for no money---....& my instinct said it might not be filled with insect eggs and Crazy glue. But even if it had been....that would have been fascinating lesson and DILUTED MY HYSTERIA and made me wiser and more secure re finding the courage to offer Joe less than his asking price after gathering more detailed data.....and I have been given very amazing advice on all parts of this!

Plus, if some moronic person might actually buy the Ugly I found.... that would have covered this toe in the water, ice-breaking ebay rug foray.
http://offer.ebay.com/ws...s&item=200293964045

On eBay I am ariesjill.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/e...m&item=200293964045

OK, that's it. I see lots of people bid on this puppy...I didn't give into the strong impulse until very late........and then it went from nothing to higher Maybe I was saved from some stupid; maybe I should just focus n Joe's rug with no practice rugs, It will come to me soon. I wil add, one of the things which held me back from the impulse until it no longer did, was the image of the underside. No edges to determiine the direction of anything.....and the weft looks pretty regimented to me. I din like that. Even I now get proper pics of the underside should be taken AT THE EDGE.

But it had a tail. And it was wagging it.

Can we sell this whole thing to HBO? lol
RugPro Offline
#11 Posted : Wednesday, January 07, 2009 8:03:19 PM(UTC)
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Couple bucks a foot for that rug. Really cant beat some of these deals online. I've seen a lot of this type being resold by craigslist sellers for up to 7 to 8 fold what the cost would be found on eBay. Win some lose some, more come around :)
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#12 Posted : Wednesday, January 07, 2009 8:22:47 PM(UTC)
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O!!!! U saw & felt the joyous tail wagging too??????? Felt its whimsy????? Believe it not that helped me just now, thaks so much!!! Tho I feel sadder NOW, THAT THE SNIPER GOT IT. Jill be nimbler.....and try not do get puppies between clients and invest more in yr instincts. Lessons, lessons, lessons.

I was scared and insecure, given my ignorance.... but I wanted it and should have gone with my instincts and entered a higher max bid when I could have. Ya know....I could have a canine rug AND a feline rug!!!!

But alas, it was the ONLY low money one I saw I was drawn to in my new obession. Out of a GAZILLION, all necrotic with NO ESSENCE or personality or harmony AT ALL, verging on- Get me the blindfold! Hit the BACKBUTTON, HURRY!!!!!

I SO APPRECIATE YOUR PRESENCE AND ALL YOU BRING.

I hope the puppy went to an individual and not a dealer.

I am exhausted. lol

Jilly
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#13 Posted : Thursday, January 08, 2009 8:42:37 AM(UTC)
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Jilly,

Welcome. However, I disagree with the statement you made above. Additionally, Our policy is no personal attacks on this forum.

Please keep entries to a bare minimum. While we appreciate participation, excessive and otherwise wordy posts may be removed at any given point in time. Any further offense may result in suspension and or permanent exclusion from participating in Forum activity.



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David Dilmaghani
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Become a Fan of Rug Rag
Guest
#14 Posted : Thursday, January 08, 2009 1:18:49 PM(UTC)
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SOOOO sorry! Mea culpa, I was sleepless, INDULGING (THAT IS THE BAD) black humor riff I am sometimes moved to among friends & often, it strike me, in my writing....without thinking......entirely irresponsible and inappropriate given the VENUE!!!! I beg forgiveness.

Mea MAXIMA culpa!!!

Jill


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#15 Posted : Friday, January 09, 2009 12:59:04 PM(UTC)
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O Deah, O Deah, O Deah. in my brief but intense new rug obsession after realizing I might now be able to replace my beloved Sarouk....and then encountering, wonderful people, ad hoc......after only days, formerly acute and well liked little Jilly has suddenly morphed into an ENRAGING LITTLE BEING! And I must NOW FIND A BUNKER into which I will retreat to save the word form my evil.

Yesterday, I was mortitfied to learn, in my sleeplessness, which manifested something indigenous to me---and, within proper forums, celebrated, even....free associative riffing.....I had committed serious violation of protocol call here however unwittingly.....and was properly called to the (pun intended) CARPET.

I had already employed RugPro's, I felt, generous and excellent questions to forward to the vendor of the rug subject of this thread.

I came home not long ago, and found what I will paste including the response I just sent.

My only confusion now is if I can FIND the bunker, which I already doubt, will THE WORLD be SAFE FROM JILLY, or should I drink the Hemlock???????? O M G.
___________________________________________________________

Hi, Joe!

Well.....congratulations of selling the rug!!!!! Maybe it did not have my name on it. And thanks for this info. It is much appreciated. And I will pass it along to the very nice human who suggested the questions I passed along to you......and please do not be insulted by them. Life is about learning!!!!!

This is a very esoteric field....and I know first hand, too often fought with dishonesty. Please do not take anything PERSONALLY, JOSEPH.

I will go on checking yr site, I do anyhow!!!!! the rug with my name on it will present, I am sure.

Jill

In a message dated 09-Jan-2009 11:33:23 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, joenevo@joenevo.net writes:
Jill,

I can find the email you sent me yesterday but someone walked in to my shop and bought that Persian rug.

Also you asked me if the rug if it is indo?

For your info GOOD indo rugs are MUCH more expensive then newish Persian rug and NO one will sell you good indo Sarough for $1950.

I sell them in my shop all the time.

If I get newish Persian rug I list on ebay or send to local auctions.

The days of Persian rug is over for few years, the good quality rugs coming from india, only Iranian people in the us looking still for Persian rug the only problem is these people do NOT know anything about Iranian rugs.

If you looking for Persian rugs you better get the rugs from 1910 to 1930, but you also can get from the 40-50 and they are ok and not lots of $.

Many Iranian people going to Iran to buy new rugs but you can buy new Iranian rug in the US

For less, I myself if I find an Iranian rug newish one from 70-90 I send to Iran for sell.

Please look on my site as below for Persian Sarough rugs and I can list for less for you on ebay.

joe

*********************************
After my evening work.....I will find that bunker it it's the last thing I do.

Jill
*********************************
EDIT

For Virgo rising completeness, I went looking for my last mail to him, which he said he could not find, found it and will paste it. I recall clearly feeling I should not ask him for return policy info.....sensing he would not like it and go off. As I now see, I also couched my questions in not attitude coping way. I have a grand trine in water natally.....I am anything but insensitive. Everyone says. But that was LAST WEEK......NOW i MUST FIND the bunker.

Maybe Universe is trying to tell me I must go ON enduring the4 gut-wrenching repulsive rug form the garbage.....and do not yet deserve to buy a replacement I will not just abide, but cherish and celebrate.......perhaps not as much as I did my Sarouk.

Below:

Hi, Joe, it is I again, Jilly.

I have some new questions and will list them; one is based on my showing the rug to someone who knows about rugs.

1) Are you sure the rug is Iranian and not form India?
2) What are the kpsi?
3) Are both ends properly finished and intact? The selvages? I can only see one.
4) This too from my new friend: has the rug been "luster washed"? Not that I know what that is, sounds like hair salon stuff, but hey.
5) I assume the pile is still sharp and clear, yes?
6) How high is up? Kidding.

Thanks, Joe,
Jill.
*********************************
Another edit:

Clearly, when someone is moved to defend something, under it all, they feel the mea culpa thingy. I am ot clueless. I now recall purposeflly not employing the rug pros insider terminology, i.e., "BLOOMING". Along with others, I only learned that term here in last days, and did not wanna portray myself as above my extremely low pay grade.

I also now get.....another of the many issues precluding my upping my max bid MORE for the little heretofore unheard of by me Sarouk rug with the personality, the verve and the wagging tail.....was, despite I am learning otherwise a BIT, I could not believe anything for no money could be anything but abject garbage......forget I still have little trust in myself in this arena. Or the arena altogether, given my wound.

That's why I felt it might at best be an experiment and learning experience which would be worth maybe $250.

Headed for evening work and then the Bunker!!!! Will no doubt have bare cement floor. The bunker.

(Sigh smilie.)



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#16 Posted : Friday, January 09, 2009 3:40:56 PM(UTC)
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Its too bad to hear this rug slipped. First, there are dealers who do sell Indian Sarouk designs for very less than this. There are not many off them and it takes some looking, but quality can be found at this price point and below if there is patience.

But in all honesty, even if it was Indian or Iranian... While it is a very attractive rug, it doesn't have nearly the contrast in the border one would expect in a carpet of this style. Although the field is beautiful, from a rug mans perspective, the border has to speak just as loudly. There are plenty more fish with tails in the ocean of online rug shopping.
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#17 Posted : Friday, January 09, 2009 3:47:12 PM(UTC)
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This will be the last one I will share; I doubt anyone is interested in this NEW War & Peace, forget I am in the dog house (wit da machine made trash)....but Joe is now apparently moved to communication....perhaps cause he feels bad about getting angry, or needs to establish his bona fides....I don know.

I only know, more unambiguously now, I have NONE in this and have also upset everyone trying to earn some.
____________________________________________________________

Hi again,

I did not know this when I inherited the rug; when the guys from this high end place on Madison Avenue came to get it to take it up and wash it, they convinced me to replace the fringes......for lots of money. But that is water under the bridge. It was am amazing rug, Joe. Looking for an exact replacement of late has taught me it would now go for around 9K at retail.....and, I am now sure, close to that when I sold it.

I assumed if a dealer bought a good rug, their goal was to double their buying price. I was terribly wrong. And.....those dealers came here cause I first called and then sent pics of the rug to someone I remember my mom talking about who is very famous rug lady, Doris Blau. (I live in Manhattan.) They told me they did not deal in these rugs but would hook me up with trustworthy dealers who did who would buy it.....they also said it was fine example of the genre.

Now U understand my wound, yes?

Jill

In a message dated 09-Jan-2009 8:17:24 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, joenevo@joenevo.net writes:
No problem and it is not a good idea to replace fringe on and old rug, you just overcast it.

99% of so called rug dealers do not know rugs and add fringe to make money.

joe
____________________________________________________

Jilly=confused, ashamed and writing between clients....many of whom are loosing their jobs and homes of late. It's all bad.
Plus I do not get if he is saying U put selvage on the fringe ends of a carpet if the original fringes start going. And I AIN GONNA ASK. Overcast? I have no clue.

Is 'ALL ORIGINAL" always a good thing????????? I think not. But I am giving up thinking. Until I feel less rattled.



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#18 Posted : Friday, January 09, 2009 3:59:21 PM(UTC)
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Rough, Very rough. Sounds like it was an awesome rug.

I am not saying anything bad about this seller, but out of the hundreds of thousands of rugs I have seen, known and learned, I honestly cannot imagine this rug which you posted is much older than 20 years. It's tough to tell by photographs, and I don't have this rug in front of me. I would trust this seller's point about age, but it just seems much newer than that to me, especially given the color combination which really speaks more of early 90s and newer. Despite condition probably being better than most rugs of 50's or 20's vintage (and certainly in a lower price category), I think it was safer to have let go than to have brought in. I have seen the rugs he comes across, many are very nice. Ask him to keep an eye out for you (with no $ deposit obligation on your part), get to know his return policy so if you do business with him in the future it's clear, and keep the door open.

Do you have pictures of the carpet which was in your family before?

Here's overcasting:

http://www.rugrag.com/po...gs-Dont-Lose-Knots.aspx

it should be found on the end of a rug which has otherwise open ends or unfinished ends. A weft runs horizontal through the rug as a continuous reinforcement. It helps keep top the top or bottom secure in place. The overcasting goes diagonally to wrap over the end, get secured through the rug sometimes 1/2 inch to 3/4 inch deep, then wraps back around the top. Proper overcasting often calls for having a weft in place so overcasting can skip several rows, and keep tension on the weft for distribution.



What do you think about this Indo Sarouk?
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#19 Posted : Friday, January 09, 2009 7:30:40 PM(UTC)
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Hi!!!!!!!

So happy for these posts both of which I only just saw. First, even if all you shared was geared to make me feel better, I don care, I liked it. I don't know diddly (not Diddy as in P) about borders technically.....but I do have an eye, and an "ear" and can delineate every detail in writing about everything. It is one of the things I do professionally. Seeing and delineating.

Thanks much for the "overcasting" tutorial, I think I now get that. Mostly.

Next, one of my regrets I may have mentioned earlier is, when the LOCUST who got my Sarouk......and his helper locust....with relish, folded, rolled & took away my rug....I followed it to the service elevator. I came back in and immediate found all the pics and destroyed them. It was just too painful, I din wanna see it again. I now regret this. Along with not having invented velcro and other things. lol

But.....other nite, I looked thru my giant copy photo drawer.......and found one which depicts only an edge of it. Not good lighting, the pic was mainly of a cat I was SITTING for a friend on vacation, fabulous creature, so it wasn't with my urg pics and iut escaped.....but at least U can see a little part of it. People always remarked on that rug....none of whom knew thing one about good rugs; it was alive, with sheen; vivid, but not vulgar and obtrusive, with clean detail in the field.....not arbitrarily meandering scrolling (yawn).....great color without being the least bit garish.

The carpet in the pic U were kind enough to link me to looks dead to me, forgive me.....and the detail within the field.....again, ARBITRARY and pseudo elegant. It makes no statement; it has no personality. It is NOT EROTIC in its essence. And by that I mean discernible viscerally.

So, what I will do, is scan this little print, download it and upload the image here. Perhaps I will get lucky and find another one which escaped my hurling out reminders of it in agony. I had GOOD ONES!

I can also see the new fringe I learned today I should not have had replaced.....tho I was thrillled with the new fringes when they brought the rug back, it was done so meticulously....forget, the hand washing rendered the rug even more alive than I had ever seen it! Could it be that ignorance can sometimes be bliss? Nah. lol


I am now getting just from the little canine tail wagging rug I was so drawn to on eBay for no money.....that my goal need not be to replicate my precious Sarouk.....but to simply get something I love......for all the detailed reasons I luv what I do.

I will be back.

Now I can focus, I just logged off my worksite.
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#20 Posted : Friday, January 09, 2009 8:30:37 PM(UTC)
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OK I did the stuff. I willl upload the scanned image

Believe me, the little you will see here is not at all a representation of the actual rug as it was---probably still is......at all. but this is image of two entities, both with excellent pile and lifeforce; one alive, the other from the 30s and ALMOST alive.

http://s150.photobucket....jill/th_Tworugsjpeg.jpg

It must be Satan, OK? I can't get rid of the first dysfunctional link, and the image still uploads tiny. and no option to enlarge using Pic & FAX viewer. I will figure this out.....I always do. Cept for rugs.

Ok see this NOW BELOW? when I said I would figure out a way to make it bigger, U thought I was KIDDING, RIGHT? OMG.
know this: the red was subtle vivid not painted red......the gold in the border & field which here looks BEIGE, IT WAS SO NOT, clear and subtle as were all the colors. This is terrible.....but I think it's all that escaped my pain-Generated hurling out and delete, delete, delete, empty recycle bin, get rid of the hurt.

We saw best example of this in Mommy Dearest! lol Course, Ms. Crawford, not exactly warm and fuzzy, boy...tore out images of some guy she felt dissed her.....and kept the rest of those images. I dissed this rug, forget shamed my dead mother (I am going for the drama but also I am serious) by having to sell it. Also, for having been naive victim of commerce.

Get the violins. Makes sure they are made by Stradivari family. lol

That track by Christina, one of my favs, 'HURT," about her late father & HER mea culpas---full affect, amazing track--- would do even better. Can I upload MP3 files here? Only half kidding.


File Attachment(s):
Jilly attached the following image(s):
One more once.JPG
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#21 Posted : Friday, January 09, 2009 9:41:30 PM(UTC)
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Ok, sleep is a conspiracy anyhow....and i no longer wanna go into The Bunker so I am in gear again more. I put this in My eBay. What do we think of this? If the circa is accurate....and God only knows and I think he likes only silk prayer rugs (lol).....that would be something at least.

But it's a little formal and boring and it is not wagging its tail. But I do not hate it. Pretty ain't enuff. I want personality. I even saw what I thought I hated....little too small and I did not think I liked tribal looking or geometric rugs.....but it has a personality, the second, no reserve one. Tho the vendor responded to a negative feedback by someone complainng what they got was machine made.....and the end of the vendor's response to the complaining customer was "....YOUR FILTHY EYES."

I adore and employ fine, trenchant sardonicism......but this was hardly that. This......was CRUDE. No pile at all, U could see the knots. lol

I will do this, one and two. Number one is a Lilian...I just discovered those and kinda like some. Some of the runners and much smaller ones on eBay of this ilk I really like a lot. But can't use them.

http://rover.ebay.com/ro...&mtid=824&kw=lg Watching

Number two, the no reserve one, from the "Yr filthy eyes" vendor....is something called a Gholtogh. Too small, but it spoke to me, I googled them and they seem to go for very low prices, I have no idea why

[THE LINKS I AM PASTING to the smaller geometric do not activate; I will now find a way of getting around this]

Almost antithetical in style......but I am getting unstuck from any given style-genre. If only in this endeavor, size matters (lol).....but species does not really, I now see.

Maybe I should try another practice purchase with the Gholtogh.

Had I a shred of integrity, I would think underground nuclear facilities & sponsoring terrorism, re Iran. But I focus on PERSIA, not the current regime. Denial can be very creative, see that?
Jilly attached the following image(s):
PIX-3558a.jpg
1645-1.jpg
2063640_main.jpg
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#22 Posted : Friday, January 09, 2009 10:32:41 PM(UTC)
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Ok CORRECTION. I quoted the wrong body part. It was "filthy mouth:....not eyes.

Negative feedback rating since this was a machine made rug it should have been mentiones clearer
s****v ( 9 )
Apr-14-08 06:18


*
Reply by masterpiecerugs (Apr-15-08 11:12):
Look at the item discription section and then open your filthy mouth, worthless!
___________________________________________________________________

And hey, I am widely published and with degree in Lit from Cornell.....but I can't spell either a lot. Left handed people never can (I am lying) so discription [sic] ain no biggie. Could be a typo...typos....are my life.

Plus my take is the buyer, from his/her negative post.....prolly don know machine loomed from hand knotted. Why? CAUSE THEY DID NOT FIND THIS SITE AND PRINT IT OUT. Is why. One can never know these thing fully.

But it also appears......and they have tons of good feedback, remember, there is a lietmotif among the negatives: when a no reserve rug goes for NO MONEY.....low bid or I saw $.99 in one neg post......the wining bidder pays but either don get the rug or is told the rug is no longer available and then sees the rug relisted. So maybe little snake oil here......if someone makes a decision to go no reserve, and very occasionally gets burned., whicxh I would thing would be inevitable....they should still MANIFEST INTEGRITY. You can not keep yr cake-rug and eat yr cake-rug too.

That is a very famous APHORISM. lol
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#23 Posted : Sunday, January 11, 2009 7:06:16 AM(UTC)
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Hey Jilly, what would you like to know about the two rugs above?
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#24 Posted : Sunday, January 11, 2009 12:55:42 PM(UTC)
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Hey!

Was away now back.

Good question. Truth be told, I am now a little shaken in my judement (read; non), and I think I was looking for general responses from someone less shaken......but still stirred. Hah.

Joe, who has kinda adopted me, go figure......mailed me that he justt got an amazing semi antique Sarouk....and had they not had "good, dry snow" snow, would have put it up on ebay already. God only know what the asking price wll be for that.....or it if necrotic, or luminous with health and life as mine was.

Please forgive my vague.

Perhaps, in the next days, I will come home, open door, enter livingroom and find my original rug back. Above it, pigs will be flying about. And the Giants will have won the Superbowl again. Let us calculate these odds now.

Sigh smilie.

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#25 Posted : Sunday, January 11, 2009 1:48:20 PM(UTC)
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Ok my addlepated brain is repairing.

re the top rug, the Lillian, however that is spelled: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260336556688&_trksid=p3907.m32&_trkparms=tab%3DWatching

1) A little formal and florid, but do you find it balanced and attractive in its essence? I do. more or less.
2) I am impressed with a)age if accurate and b) condition if accurate.
3) given all of the above and the genre, since the asking price is 1100. If do "make offer" could get it for 1K, would that be a good deal?
4) this vendor has been around since 03 and with 100% feedback. That says something. And I kinda like rugandroll......it is very not Doris Duke.
5) I notice, while all the images are clear and crisp and informing....the one exception is the underside shot. What does this mean? this ain't serendipity. Is it dippity doo-doo? Malfeasance? Relatedly, very oveblow retail estimates erode my trust; this thing will be worth $3,790 if the economy resurrects next week. Even I get that.

Lower rug.....I just checked, it is now at $20.....with long time to go. I am usually not drawn t tribal or angular....but this angular has some charm, grace and is not capricious. I like the colors. Kinda. Go figure. And I like the balance. It has some personality. Is it garbage?

LINK

I know nothing about this genre of rug or their value; I care nothing about cache. It also appears to have some sheen.
"Luster washed" very mysterious phenomenon to me. Also to CSI Miami. lol I feel, given the above, I should maybe break out of my confusion, paralysis and paranoia by maybe trying for it as the practice purchase rug.....on my way to the real rug. If I cold get it for little money. Unless it is abject garbage and not worth another thought.

I now think I should give up on even the premise I can replicate my rug; I see the prices and I do ot have that kinda money to spend on a rug. I think I should learn, see peripherally, be open.....and just get something I really like, hopefully a decent deal in which I do not feel a victim. Period.

At least all this was less vague, and I thank you for asking.
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#26 Posted : Sunday, January 11, 2009 9:30:58 PM(UTC)
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Well, the smaller(of the two above) tribal-looking rug with the angularity, but to me, still with some charm...is already at $167.50 with over 17 hours to go in the auction. I have no clue what it might be worth. NOT A CLUE.

I see things I simply can not believe people bid on at all. But they do. I now think NO RESERVE is, to some buyers on eBay, like slot machines are to others at casinos. I mean it. Boy, this is interesting. Also....depressing.
***********************************************

OK EDIT!

Well, I Googled. Googling=ALWAYS THE RIGHT THING DO DO EVERY SECOND.

Re the above: "One of a kind" my butt: http://rover.ebay.com/ro...&mtid=824&kw=lg

And it wasn't ONE OF A KIND ON DEC 3TH EITHER, when one of it's litter mates sold for $129, OK? Do not pee on my leg and tell me it is RAINING. (Title of Judge Judy book, amazing, right?)

U just can not make this stuff up. OK, U can....if you're a writer for LAW & ORDER, Special Victims' Unit..
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