Welcome Guest Search | Active Topics | Log In | Register

What is this and how overpriced is it?
Ed Offline
#1 Posted : Saturday, July 25, 2009 8:02:13 AM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 6/29/2009(UTC)
Posts: 129
Points: 408
Location: Florida
Saw this and couldn't believe it and then looked at his other rugs. Wow is all I can say except buyer beware. http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/7...:1|294:200#ht_8021wt_803
Sponsor  
 

Love the Rug Rag Forums?

Register above, then purchase a monthly Forum Pass for Full Access

Ed Offline
#2 Posted : Sunday, July 26, 2009 4:13:38 AM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 6/29/2009(UTC)
Posts: 129
Points: 408
Location: Florida
I have no idea were this is from but I'd guess China or that area. Someone must recognize this type of rug. It can't be worth more than a couple hundred bucks. Any help would be appreciated. KrowGyrl was talking about deceptive ads in another post but this guy is just lying and if you tell eBay they won't do anything.
RugPro Offline
#3 Posted : Sunday, July 26, 2009 8:06:56 AM(UTC)
Rank: Administration

Groups: Administration, Dealers, Member

Joined: 2/9/2008(UTC)
Posts: 2,285
Points: 6,103
Location: New York
there are a few sellers i used to report all the time. ebay does nothing, buyers get ripped off.

this rug has me confused. ordinarily i would not comment on something unless i have a very good idea of what it is, but I do think I can say it does not appear to be older than first quarter 20th (being generous), and I would almost be tempted to give a turkish attribution. It's not impossible this could sell for 1k retail, I'm just not familiar. if I had to say, this is one of the sellers favorite pieces, may account for the seemingly exorbitant asking price

Since joining this forum a long while back, ive talked to some of these sellers about what they advertise and may or may not misrepresent. many of them just pass on the information they were given, and in many cases are just not well versed on rugs themselves. wonder if that is still considered a min khani design?
Ed Offline
#4 Posted : Sunday, July 26, 2009 10:44:15 AM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 6/29/2009(UTC)
Posts: 129
Points: 408
Location: Florida
I was thinking Peking or Tibet but I'm late and have to go get back to this later. Maybe made to order or something. Turkey is a possibility though.
Ed Offline
#5 Posted : Monday, July 27, 2009 2:27:28 PM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 6/29/2009(UTC)
Posts: 129
Points: 408
Location: Florida
I did a little research and I think this is a Khotan rug mid 20th century probably but it's hard to date. Nice colors really and not a bad rug but certainly not a Kazak. Here is a link to one with similar colors http://www.spongobongo.com/em/sny9938.htm
Retail might be up to $1000 but I'm not up on prices really now with the crunch and after looking at some of the auction results you can buy some nice pieces for reasonable prices.

jahannandsons Offline
#6 Posted : Tuesday, August 04, 2009 7:58:40 AM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Member

Joined: 6/18/2009(UTC)
Posts: 127
Points: 405
Location: Kensington, MD
If it is actually antique, it is probably worth $500 at most.

To me, though, it looks like an Afghani piece circa 1980s-1990s. Probably would sell it for $125 it I had it in inventory.

Jahann and Sons Persian Rugs
4210 Howard Ave | Kensington, MD 20895
301.530.6660 | www.jahannandsons.com
Ed Offline
#7 Posted : Tuesday, August 04, 2009 1:22:29 PM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 6/29/2009(UTC)
Posts: 129
Points: 408
Location: Florida
You really think this is from Afghanistan maybe you should ask someone in your family for a second opinion. I still say Khotan and newer but not that new.
RugPro Offline
#8 Posted : Wednesday, August 05, 2009 6:12:29 AM(UTC)
Rank: Administration

Groups: Administration, Dealers, Member

Joined: 2/9/2008(UTC)
Posts: 2,285
Points: 6,103
Location: New York
I neverseen a newer khotan weaving before. This one doesn't seem consistent with many older ones I have. These rugs were hardly ever woven without a heavy, subtle to heavy chinese undertone. This example, you don't see that. No running t border, nothing. The design is like a varamin, but simple. Like Turkish. I would not have ever said khotan myself, but I suppose it's completely possible. What specifically leads you to khotan as opposed to another weaving area.
Ed Offline
#9 Posted : Thursday, August 06, 2009 3:35:25 PM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 6/29/2009(UTC)
Posts: 129
Points: 408
Location: Florida
The weave is what made me believe that China was the origin of this rug when I first said Peking. The wool isn't as good as you would see in Peking or Khotan
rugs of old but standards change and they weave just for the money. Not that they didn't weave for profit in the old days, I just think they did it better before interference. I know I'm a little stubborn and I could easily be wrong and would love to have someone identify it's true origin if it isn't a Khotan rug.
RugPro Offline
#10 Posted : Thursday, February 04, 2010 5:37:12 PM(UTC)
Rank: Administration

Groups: Administration, Dealers, Member

Joined: 2/9/2008(UTC)
Posts: 2,285
Points: 6,103
Location: New York
this is the follow up on the rug ed http://www.oriental-rugs...azak-bordjalou-rug.html I guess they bought it off ebay. It actually looks to me like a turkish yatak
Shereen Offline
#11 Posted : Friday, February 05, 2010 9:33:35 AM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Member

Joined: 11/21/2009(UTC)
Posts: 261
Points: 819
Location: connecticut, USA
I can see the aesthetic affinity to khotan design of the roundish "guls", also the affinity to turkish yatak.

How about a Zakatale Yatak? Cf. the similarity of weave, colourscheme, warps-wool (i.e. fringe) and dimensions HERE:

http://rover.ebay.com/ro...&mtid=824&kw=lg

see also uploaded pictures, or go to spongobongo Zatala.
Shereen attached the following image(s):
zakatale back.jpg
zakatala 3.jpg
zakatale.jpg
bukhara Offline
#12 Posted : Friday, February 05, 2010 1:49:59 PM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Member, Dealers

Joined: 10/19/2009(UTC)
Posts: 283
Points: 864
Location: Luxembourg
WOW! Laughing for 30 minutes. Thanks ! How many erroneous opinions from the people for whom carpets - is work or business. Kazak Bordjalou rug - everything is written correctly. Any carpets dealer from Caucasus (not the one who learned caucasian carpets on the books) will confirm this.
RugPro Offline
#13 Posted : Friday, February 05, 2010 2:36:11 PM(UTC)
Rank: Administration

Groups: Administration, Dealers, Member

Joined: 2/9/2008(UTC)
Posts: 2,285
Points: 6,103
Location: New York
if I didn't know any better, I would think that's your rug Bukhara.
bukhara Offline
#14 Posted : Friday, February 05, 2010 2:58:07 PM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Member, Dealers

Joined: 10/19/2009(UTC)
Posts: 283
Points: 864
Location: Luxembourg
Yes, is my rug. And I do not hide this
RugPro Offline
#15 Posted : Friday, February 05, 2010 3:12:02 PM(UTC)
Rank: Administration

Groups: Administration, Dealers, Member

Joined: 2/9/2008(UTC)
Posts: 2,285
Points: 6,103
Location: New York
Ok, but there's no reason to insult anyone on the forum. All contributions are appreciated. You haven't had flawless identifications yourself, and I'm not convinced you're right.
Shereen Offline
#16 Posted : Friday, February 05, 2010 3:32:43 PM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Member

Joined: 11/21/2009(UTC)
Posts: 261
Points: 819
Location: connecticut, USA
So, Bukhara, what about the one I linked to then, I link it here again: http://rover.ebay.com/ro...&mtid=824&kw=lg

Is it also a Kazak Bordjalou or is it a Kasak Zakatale, as the seller says it is?
bukhara Offline
#17 Posted : Friday, February 05, 2010 11:42:25 PM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Member, Dealers

Joined: 10/19/2009(UTC)
Posts: 283
Points: 864
Location: Luxembourg
RugPro wrote:
and I'm not convinced you're right.


RugPro, You attributed this rug to turkish yatak only for one reason - the size. Are there any other features that can characterize this rug as turkish yatak and allowing you to make the conclusions that I am wrong?
bukhara Offline
#18 Posted : Friday, February 05, 2010 11:44:10 PM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Member, Dealers

Joined: 10/19/2009(UTC)
Posts: 283
Points: 864
Location: Luxembourg
Shereen wrote:
So, Bukhara, what about the one I linked to then, I link it here again: http://rover.ebay.com/ro...&mtid=824&kw=lg

Is it also a Kazak Bordjalou or is it a Kasak Zakatale, as the seller says it is?


This is NOT Kazak Bordjalou and NOT Kasak Zakatale, and NOT from Caucasus.
RugPro Offline
#19 Posted : Saturday, February 06, 2010 8:18:29 AM(UTC)
Rank: Administration

Groups: Administration, Dealers, Member

Joined: 2/9/2008(UTC)
Posts: 2,285
Points: 6,103
Location: New York
I lean more toward caucuses, but I did think this was interesting. i have seen other examples very similar, but this is just one. I do not think the rug you have is older than 1920's max
RugPro attached the following image(s):
oldcatalog.jpg
oldcatalog2.jpg
Shereen Offline
#20 Posted : Saturday, February 06, 2010 10:17:29 AM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Member

Joined: 11/21/2009(UTC)
Posts: 261
Points: 819
Location: connecticut, USA
RugPro wrote:
I lean more toward caucuses, but I did think this was interesting. i have seen other examples very similar, but this is just one. I do not think the rug you have is older than 1920's max


I've never seen a 19th century / early 20th century Borjalu where the barber pole wasn't adjacent to the selvages (as opposed to having a strip of knots of the selvage color in between), nor one with ivory wefts, nor one with the selvages so tightly wrapped (which of course doesn't mean they aren't out there somewhere).

Bukhara, are the two pics attached Caucasian in your view?

Shereen attached the following image(s):
ZZ.jpg
ZZZ.jpg
bukhara Offline
#21 Posted : Saturday, February 06, 2010 11:56:40 AM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Member, Dealers

Joined: 10/19/2009(UTC)
Posts: 283
Points: 864
Location: Luxembourg
It's hard to say because it seems to photos taken in strong sunlight. I'm not sure if is a photo reflects the actual color. But the fact that I see on my screen, I think it is not Caucasian. It's more like Kurdish for me.
Shereen Offline
#22 Posted : Saturday, February 06, 2010 1:42:37 PM(UTC)
Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Member

Joined: 11/21/2009(UTC)
Posts: 261
Points: 819
Location: connecticut, USA
Thanks!
Users browsing this topic
Guest
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

Powered by YAF | YAF © 2003-2010, Yet Another Forum.NET
This page was generated in 0.303 seconds.