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Experts advice needed for Hereke
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Ardo Sasso Offline
#1 Posted : Tuesday, April 21, 2009 7:29:29 AM(UTC)
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Hi all

I am interested in purchasing twin signed Ocveik Hereke or so translated (Last of Turkish Kum Kapi master weaver) with following details;
Size 230x130cm each
Pure silk with metal threads
In very good condition
Age around 50 years
Asking price $30,000
Location; Middle East

Any advice is appreciated before end of April

Regards
Ardo Sasso
Ardo Sasso attached the following image(s):
Rear corner view.JPG
P1010349.JPG
P1010366.JPG
P1010352.JPG
Ocveik Hereke signature.JPG
Silk with metal threads.JPG
Front corner view.JPG
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Guest
#2 Posted : Wednesday, April 22, 2009 7:48:03 PM(UTC)
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Hi, Ardo!

I am no way expert in rugs, trust me; the little I know I know I learned here.
So pls be patient & wait a legit expert to weigh in.

Having said that, I think the rug is very interesting and I do like the metallic threads common to this genre, but the low thread count.....assuming an inch in France is same as an inch in NY (lol)....troubles me. I could be wrong, but the kpsi don't appear high at all. I get just over a hundred......tho given the complexity of the design, that makes little sense. Unlessssss.....that rule is cms and not inches. If so, then the kpsis would be around 700 I believe. Which would be normal. Do you know if the ruler is cms or inches?

Pls see this:
http://www.rugrag.com/po...d-Hereke-Prayer-Rug.aspx

It is from right here. That is a true antique. The lot was from way back in 81, of course, but it didn't sell, meaning it most likely didn't meet the reserve.

But given the asking price of the rug you are asking about and what I see as low kpsi (again, unless the ruler is cms)...... unless I am missing something, I would be very careful were I you and get as much info as you can. Let's say the ruler is cms and the kpsi are around 700. Even so, I think the asking price is insane given the rug is not an antique or a very special prayer Kereke.

I have no clue what the signature on the kilim says or means. Hopefully someone can give you data on that as well. Who is offering this Hereke?
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Ardo Sasso Offline
#3 Posted : Thursday, April 23, 2009 4:35:53 AM(UTC)
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Hi Jilly

The ruler is in cm, so your guess of 700ksi is correct, the asking price is also strange to me however in my presence the amount of $20,000 was already paid.
I will be waiting for further quotes
Regards
Ardo
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Guest
#4 Posted : Thursday, April 23, 2009 10:46:23 AM(UTC)
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Hi again!

Thanks much for this info...NOW, it makes sense. Can't wait to read authentically expert responses.

Jilly
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RugPro Offline
#5 Posted : Thursday, April 23, 2009 1:07:07 PM(UTC)
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hi ardo!

awesome rug. cool to read they're twins. age could be newer. are you purchasing from an individual or a company?
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Ardo Sasso Offline
#6 Posted : Thursday, April 23, 2009 6:47:13 PM(UTC)
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Hi again

I am planning to purchase from a company dealing with rugs, as for age, to my knwoledge the weaver died in a car accident near Hereke back in 1971.
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ruggalleria Offline
#7 Posted : Friday, April 24, 2009 6:50:21 PM(UTC)
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Hi from the pictures this isnt a fine for silk carpet. its approx 60raj or 529 kpsi basically it way over priced due to the knots and being a semi antique not a antique rug.. 7500-10000 is the max
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RugPro Offline
#8 Posted : Saturday, April 25, 2009 9:44:33 AM(UTC)
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Hey Ruggalleria


Don't forget there are two rugs here. They're being sold as twins according to ardo.

Also, knot density looks higher than 529 to my eye, and I am unaware of anyone who would use RAJ for a Turkish rug do hereke have similar horizontal and vertical as tabriz?
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#9 Posted : Saturday, April 25, 2009 9:53:13 AM(UTC)
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RugPro wrote:
Hey Ruggalleria


Don't forget there are two rugs here. They're being sold as twins according to ardo.

Also, knot density looks higher than 529 to my eye, and I am unaware of anyone who would use RAJ for a Turkish rug do hereke have similar horizontal and vertical as tabriz?



As I said in my post, coming to the ruler may be in cms,which it is... I got around 700 kpsi and Ardo confirmed this.
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