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jesco white Offline
#1 Posted : Tuesday, November 10, 2009 3:40:42 PM(UTC)
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Hi everyone,

I'm new to the forum and have inherited a rug I don't know anything about. I don't care about appraisals or value but love handmade rugs and am hoping this might be one. I've surfed the internet reading everything I can and I'm hoping it might be a Kazak rug based on the abrash colors and geometric designs.

The first picture is the top, kinda small, not much detail. The second picture is the back with the knots and a little fringe. That one's big and might give you more detail. Or if you email me I'll email you back better pictures. chinesenickel@yahoo.com

http://img69.imageshack....mg69/7476/unkownrug.jpg
http://img97.imageshack....g97/440/unknownback.jpg

Any thoughts? Any shared insight would be greatly appreciated.

Jesco White
Tucson AZ
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jesco white Offline
#2 Posted : Tuesday, November 10, 2009 4:14:10 PM(UTC)
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Alright I just noticed the attach button so I'll try and attach a picture of the front.

What do you folks think? Machine made? :(

Ed, Rug Pro, Chris? I've been reading through other threads and I'm amazed at your knowledge.
jesco white attached the following image(s):
unkown rug.jpg
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netjim Offline
#3 Posted : Tuesday, November 10, 2009 5:00:23 PM(UTC)
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My thoughts are mostly from the other pic but it really doesn't show the detail the forum asks for.
Please show a closer pic of the rear at one end, clearly showing the fringe.....perhaps at a corner.
What I see in the one pic of the rear would seem to indicate that the fringe has been applied as on a machine made rug.
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jesco white Offline
#4 Posted : Tuesday, November 10, 2009 5:33:48 PM(UTC)
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Hey thanks for the reply Net Jim. I know the pictures are lacking but that's all I've got right now. Unfortunately I took the pics before I stumbled on to this amazing website.

Here's a couple detail pics--does this tell you anything else? Anyone else want to chime in?


jesco white attached the following image(s):
Unknown back detail.jpg .jpg
unknown back corner.jpg
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RugPro Offline
#5 Posted : Tuesday, November 10, 2009 5:57:58 PM(UTC)
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this is a machine made carpet, probably synthetic. Design is eclectic, it's a mix from many weaving areas. Machine made rugs sometimes mix them up more than hand knotted.
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jesco white Offline
#6 Posted : Tuesday, November 10, 2009 6:19:43 PM(UTC)
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Hey thanks--that's what I suspected... But the funny thing is researching this rug has me hooked on real deal. The more I read the more I want to know and the more I want to pick up a couple rugs of my own.

In fact I contacted an Afghani friend of mine who travels back and forth between the US and Afghanistan and he's excited to shop rugs for me. He was born and raised there and speaks the language. He just needs to know what I'm looking for and he'll do the rest. He'll even bring a couple back for me with no shipping costs.

That said, what would some of you rug experts be in the market for if you were in my shoes? Types of Afghan rugs, styles, designs? Colors?

Any thoughts on Afghan made Kazaks?
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Chris Offline
#7 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 1:05:05 AM(UTC)
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Hi Jesco.

The easiest way to find a good worthfull old rug is to go to an auctioneer. It must be one of the famous who sell fine rugs. And than you fasten on some of the professionell buyers, it must be a group of Afghanis or Iranis. Wait. Find a rug you like. Wait a while. If there are three or even better more bidders on this piece you have to do a bid, buy the rug with a price you fixed before.

Chris
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jesco white Offline
#8 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 4:24:42 AM(UTC)
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Wow, interesting strategy. So basically go to a reputable auction, wait for some local buyer to show interest in a rug and then outbid them?

Chris have you ever bought locally from Afghanistan? Can anyone ballpark a price range for a high quality 7x10' or so rug at an Afghani auction?
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bukhara Offline
#9 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 5:20:26 AM(UTC)
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high quality 7x10 'will have a price around 1000 $ (for example Mushwani rugs)
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Chris Offline
#10 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 5:35:56 AM(UTC)
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Yes. This is the only way to buy as a newby without making big loss. Otherwise you are buying without knowledge but with great passion.
I never bought from Afghanistan. Mushwani old Baluch f.e., bukhara told before, are good pieces from there. But how will you decide it is old? It should be from natural colors.
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jesco white Offline
#11 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 5:49:17 AM(UTC)
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Great advice, and not something I would have ever thought of on my own... Thanks guys.

$1000 is a lot of money for me; hypothetically if my buddy out bids a handful of local buyers on a rug and ships it back here for free is the payoff there? I'm not going to re-sell it but would you say it's a risk I should take?

Or as a novice should I just give him a couple hundred bucks to play with and find something new that I just like? Like an Afghan made Kazak?
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bukhara Offline
#12 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 5:49:49 AM(UTC)
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I have told about NEW Mushwani rugs, they are a bit similar to Tekke, but have very small gul. colors like Khal Mohammadi, but their quality much better. They have a warp from light wool.
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Chris Offline
#13 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 5:57:01 AM(UTC)
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Bad idea, Jesco. You will gamble with your money...and this in that hard times. Buy as i said on an auction. Look for cataloges. Go online. Why it must be an Afghan? And why an Afghan Kazak? What the hell is an Afghan Kazak? Do you mean the kind of Afghan Chobi there are on market?
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Chris Offline
#14 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 5:59:53 AM(UTC)
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Take a look at metropolitancarpet.com to get a overview were you are looking for. There are seller prices, not auction prices.
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jesco white Offline
#15 Posted : Wednesday, November 11, 2009 6:14:34 AM(UTC)
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Thanks Chris for the auction website.

Hahaha I guess I don't know what the hell and Afghan made Kazak is either... I'm embarrassed to be in the company of you guys, knowing as little as I do.

The reason I'm asking about Afghan rugs is because I have an Afghani friend who comes and goes from the US and Afghanistan and speaks the language. I showed some interested in Afghani rugs and he's excited to buy one for me and bring it back.

Personally I like Kazak rugs which I understand are Caucasian, not Persian. But reading online I've found that some Afghan rug makers have adopted that style? But then again I don't really know what I'm talking about so anyone who wants to jump in that'd be great.

I'm interested to see if my Afghani friend is willing to go to some local auctions for me but I love the idea. Maybe he'd be willing to go a few up just to get a feel for how they work and what rugs are going for. Then after he's a little more familiar with the process/prices he could buy one for me.
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