Update;

Just found this reply:

Dear ariesjill,

Dear ebayer,

Thank you for your email and your interest in our large selection of fine rugs. This rug that you are inquiring about is certainly one of our highest quality.

Re: http://rover.ebay.com/ro...9&mtid=824&kw=lg

This rug is so fine that its holding in excellent condition, and that is typical because its made of the finest threads - 100% kork - its pile has not lost its touch. This is classified in excellent condition, there is no pile low on this rug. There is not anything on this rug other than 100% kork and these weavers are professional when dyeing the colors to be used. This being a Sarough are typically red and navy blue tones and floral. There is no color run on this rug, it just does not happen with kork and a rug they choose to make knowing that this rug is going to be exquisite, unique, one-of-a-kind. The kpsi is 200 which that is a very good tight knotting to this and will make this rug last a lifetime. Makes a nice heirloom.

If there is any other questions, please do not hesitate to contact us again.

All the best,
Mari
_____________________________________________________
I believe her. is cause I wanna?
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Edit:

Another REAL possibility form same vendor;
OK, another......and this one I even LIKE tho it has the giant bias tape. Life is sometimes mitigating unrealistic expectations:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/e...IT&item=140243132254

When I first came upon a rug with the giant bias tape and posted it, someone posted this is a marker for newer rugs made in Iran. But since, in my manic search, I have seen indo rugs with the same thing. I find it an abrogation of the classic tenets of hand knotted rugs......but I have lowered my standards and trying to keep an open mind.

Big enough, not ideal, but big enough. A Sarouk. Is is this gorgeous like the Heriz I like? No. But I asked the VENDOR OF THAT RUG about it and they have not replied. Nobody knows the reality of that rug, OK? The real colors, the real condition, if it has color run.....and it has V low kpsi. No way NOW.....will I take a chance on it, end up with it at maybe 1K and end up with garbage and n shock for 24 hours and probably more than 24.

Assuming their listing is accurate in specifics (not suggested retail, obviously), is this rug worth what they are asking for it?

Do we trust this vendor? Yes, right? I feel now, I will get a rug form these people. Unless someone with a brain tells me why I should not.

This rug is so fine

"He's so fine, wish he were mine,
that handsome rug over there, the one with the wavy hair,
I don't know how I'm gonna do it,
but I'm gonna make him mine....."

Doo Ramm, Doo Ramm, doo ramm. OMG, it's now a rug asylum wit a girl group soundtrack!!!!!
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HOLD IT! I sand corrected and must change my membership in the R&R Hall of Fame to The R&R Hall of SHAME. It's Do LANG, not Do RAMM. My apologies to The Chiffons.

He's so fine
(Do-lang-do-lang-do-lang)
Wish he were mine
(Do-lang-do-lang-do-lang)
That handsome boy overthere
(Do-lang-do-lang-do-lang)
The one with the wavy hair
(Do-lang-do-lang-do-lang)
I don't know how I'm gonna do it
(Do-lang-do-lang-do-lang)
But I'm gonna make him mine

Pls bear with me; I am extremely tired. THIS is the Sarouk I now want, same vendor but nicer colors and navy field in the borders: http://rover.ebay.com/ro...9&mtid=824&kw=lg

I will now do the new Jilly, blow it up and mark it & count the kpsi thingy with this one.....but bet it's the same as the one above.

oK cause of their image of the underside of the one I want....I could only blow it up to 150%. I count 12 X 15. I put dots at the top cause the actual inch ends right at the top of the image in this one. I was wrong, it is ot the same as the above rug.

If this counting is right......this one is 180 KPSI. IS THIS RIGHT?

And....it looks like KORK TO ME, OK? but I need to put a cork in it, nobody has to say it. Only reason I am sayin that is cause I see sheen on the knots. But it could be the crystal meth. hahahahahahah Something called KORk, I feel intutively....has SHEEN.

OK, maybe not sheen exactly, but does it not look like very fine wool?

Ok WAIT: Am I seeing double knots---I counted those as one-- cause I am sleeepless for days? Are they there? If so, what does that mean??? Can we learn more stuff about this rug from that if they are??

Hey!

Interesting. I am new at this counting and can not be trusted. I have now received responses to my last mail to them and from two humans. I have already responded to them and will paste below. I remember, no need to reiterate, yr contempt for the worthless "certificates' not comporting with the carefully arrived at standards of THIS COMMUNITY AS OVERSEEING BODY.

Now that I know four things.....and am pissed and refuse to be victim again, I am going to hold their wefts to the fire until I feel they have earned some trust. Bad part: I want the rug. Good part, I am no longer the clueless rug slut I was few weeks ago.

You will see from one mail.....they are gettin that a little. which is why I challenged them on the knots. Am I disgusted by their disingenuous, patronizing pitch for Sarouks? IS THE POPE GERMAN? But at this point, and I have earned this right here, over time.....nobody should mess wit me.....cause I will run illuminated, condescending nuance on you, if you have bad dye, your colors will start running visibly, and you will not even know it, OK? Most vomit-making part.....they offered to save me $50 and send the worthless certificate. I fele liike hitten them wit a brick. Cause people emrging as untrustworthy HURTS, and anger is a defesnes agaisnt pain. But I don do the hitting stuff. Evah.

Do not make me send Tom Hagen to have someone put the head of that heartbreaking, pathetic leopord rug in yr bed, OK?

Below:
Hello, Arash (thank goodness it's not ABRASH):

You need not pitch Sarouks to me; I was raised with antique "American" Saroughs, each a splendid example of the genre.

If I may again request....unless that is it's too much trouble--some high resolution (macromode would be best) closeup images of the top of the pile in good light so that I might determine the nature of the wool. Tt should take no time, given the realities of digital.

Famous saying, "Trust but verify." Re certificates: such documents are easily generated; we must consider the Bona fides of the verifying bodies. Not to insult you, but we all know the unfortunate reputation of this industry and why it is not held in high esteem, yes?

Thanks in advance,
Jill



In a message dated 07-Feb-2009 2:16:57 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, member@ebay.com writes:
eBay sent this message to Jill Morris (ariesjill).
Your registered name is included to show this message originated from eBay. Learn more.


Seller has responded to your question about this item

Do not respond to the sender if this message requests that you complete the transaction outside of eBay. This type of offer is against eBay policy, may be fraudulent, and is not covered by buyer protection programs. Learn More.

Dear ariesjill,

Dear Jill,
Thank you very much for your interest in our rugs, especially this stunning piece of Persian art. I see that you have an eye for details and I have to say I admire you for that. This is a genuine Persian rug and if purchase the rug, I'd be happy to send you the certificate of authenticity at no extra charge (we normally charge $50 for the certificate). As for the KPSI, I have to say knot density varies throughout a rug. That means, when a rug is made, it's usually woven tighter in the middle and where the intricate designs are, same goes for this rug. Kpsi is up to 200 on this rug. The rug is in excellent condition and there are no wear on it. Sarough rugs are among the finest of Persian rugs and durability is what makes them so special. This is a rug that will last a very long time and you can enjoy it's beauty as well as quality.
Please do not hesitate to contact us if you have any other questions or concerns.
Regards,
Arash
803-802-5023


- fantasyrugs
____________________________________________

Hi, Mari,

I am pasting what I just sent to your colleague Arash:


Hello, Arash (thank goodness it's not ABRASH):

You need not pitch Sarouks to me; I was raised with antique "American" Saroughs, each a splendid example of the genre.

If I may again request....unless that is it's too much trouble--some high resolution (macromode would be best) closeup images of the top of the pile in good light so that I might determine the nature of the wool. Tt should take no time, given the realities of digital.

Famous saying, "Trust but verify." Re certificates: such documents are easily generated; we must consider the Bona fides of the verifying bodies. Not to insult you, but we all know the unfortunate reputation of this industry and why it is not held in high esteem, yes?

Thanks in advance,
Jill

In a message dated 07-Feb-2009 3:15:49 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, fantasy_rugs@yahoo.com writes:

Greetings to you again

Re: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/e...eName=ADME:X:AAQ:US:1123

This is lovely. Its design is so clear and clean, its colors so nicely entailing its decoration - it is very lovely. There again, the Sarough is just a fine rug.

The Item Description is sent to us along with the rugs when they are all shipped from Iran. That is who we deal directly with. So with that said, we take their word that all the information they sent us is all facts. The pictures that are shown for the public view is all we got.

If there is any other questions or concerns, please feel free to call our office. Our sales representatives are from Iran themselves and they can surely answer all your questions or concerns you may have. Our phone numbers are 1-866-647-3965 or 1-877-888-8784.

All the best,
Mari
********************************************
And takes? Did I, in fact see double knots? Will we, in fact, be ale to deterine the identityof the wool form what I yet again requested? Let us say Pro's counting is correct. Let us say the wool ight be Kork. Would all htat add up to a decent asking price for this rug??????

Re the above,last edit, I just sent this below; it's a JOURNEY, and I now refuse to miss any steps to full illumination. U want me to buy the rug? Manifest integrity and class. Character is destiny. The days of dogs and ponies are on the wane.

Hi agian, Arash,

Re this:
As for the KPSI, I have to say knot density varies throughout a rug. That means, when a rug is made, it's usually woven tighter in the middle and where the intricate designs are, same goes for this rug. Kpsi is up to 200 on this rug.

This Sarouk in design, tries to emulate the overall field pattern of the "American" Saouks I grew up with.....tho those, as you know, were painted for the American market. It has no center medallion. Its real complexity is in its borders.

Thanks agian, I need to deal in the good faith I insist on with people with integrity. I look forward to the images of the pile, I truly do!
Jill
______________________________
Like Matt, these people are in NC. Think Arash is auditioning to play back court for Duke? Feels like it, right?
_______________________________
OK it does, in fact have a center medallion, but it is not A significant one.. Again, the real complex is in the borders. I was pissed, OK? For me, not much worse than phonies and opportunists...with zero self esteem and class. Makes me SICK. Earn some RESPECT, for God's sake!
________________________________
Edit: Must start evening work. I have googled the below forevah and with no results, and I wanna KNOW:


Forgive this, Arash.....One more, if I may:
re the tape along the underside of the selvedge edges. would this Sarouk maintain its integrity without this? Are the selvedges finished normally under this tape which may be some new thing, but I do not understand the purpose of or need for it. Again, I appreciate yr help; none of these questions are arbitrary; each is most important. Clearly, there is no way I can see this rug in person.

Jill



*********************************
Must stop Googling and work. Just found this from RIGHT HERE:

Qurk / Kork Wool: Qurk wool is taken from the neck, belly and underarms of the sheep. This is often considered the most choice of wool to come from the sheep, as it is very fine, thin, and long stapled. Kork wool is most often reserved for only the finest of weavings. Perhaps this type of wool is most commonly found in high KPSI isfahan, nain Oriental Rugs. The appearance of fairly untreated Qurk wool has almost a dull finish, yet very compact, firm and dense feeling pile.

So much for the imagined sheen.

Jilly, these people are idiots. it's extremely rare to find a rug from iran with kork wool if it's under 400 kpsi. PERIOD. Kork wool is not always from lambs. it also comes from the necks underarms and bellies of sheep.

Are all these images from one of the two rugs above?

Heads Up (I just logged off eveing work early):

They are, in fact, still making Kork rugs in Iran. This from 05. My take is, they could be around 200 kpsi and not necessarily finer. This is a far more commercial business than once, remember! Pls see what Google just Brought:

http://www.jozan.net/2005/Isfahan-rugs.asp

Now, I must find out if they use Kork in Markazi .....the province the vendor says this rug was made in.
________________________________________

Edit: I already just learned that in this province....along with whatever else they make, they make machine loomed, neo classic persian rugs of poly. Nice. We can see clearly, the sarouk is hand knotted.....and, admit, it, with decent KPSI.

_______________________________________
Edit 2: Ferahan.......is IN THIS PROVENCE.
______________________________________

Edit 3: http://www.iran-daily.co...87/3123/html/iranica.htm It's all about Arak....has been for centuries.
_______________________________________

Edit 4: (I need sleep very badly) I just did a creative Jilly; I went onto Rugman site and send this message:

Hi, Do you have any newly made in Iran Sarouks made of Kork wool? Around 8 X 11? With good kpsi?

Thanks much,
Jill

Final step I can try: find email an actual Iranian rug company same question.

This is now like torture a little.
_______________________________
Edit 5: I came upon this well done, classy appearing side: http://www.minasian.com/contact.html

I just sent this:
Greetings.

Lovely site. Hand knotted with high KPSI. lol If I may take advantage by asking this question: are neo Sarouks being made now in Iran of Kork wool?

Bless you for any data you might provide,
Jill
___________________________________
Edit 6: (even when COMPLETELY OUTTA GAS, I find the FUNNY, U gotta ADMIT):

http://orientalrugcompany.com/

Hello,

If I may impose with a general question: are neo Sarouks being made now in Iran of Kork wool?

Also....is Karzan single? (Kidding.)

Jill
in Manhattan

THIS is why we need 3 computers and Mach 20 BROADBAND, ok? This...s WHY, OK? And ladies (U awake Bonnie??), if U think George Clooney is cute (he is not) check out Kazan.

This one has those things yu mentioned. I wouldn't worry too much about them. some say they could be a bad sign, but I've seen them on some of the finest rugs too